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Discussion of Dexos oil Certification

What does the certification mean?

Re: Discussion of Dexos oil Certification

Postby EKinMN » Oct 26 2011, 3:48am

Amen Brother Groecki....SS Premium Synthetic Low Friction UltraLube! Man that would be worth $15 a quart (even though it would be Amsoil, bought at a volume discount from Mike, at about 1/2 that price!) :lol: :lol:
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Re: Discussion of Dexos oil Certification

Postby Gorecki » Oct 26 2011, 4:05am

EKinMN wrote:Amen Brother Groecki....SS Premium Synthetic Low Friction UltraLube! Man that would be worth $15 a quart (even though it would be Amsoil, bought at a volume discount from Mike, at about 1/2 that price!) :lol: :lol:


Gotta keep the KickAss part though! The sub-line could be ...it smells like bananas and tastes like chicken, chicks will dig you! :D
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Re: Discussion of Dexos oil Certification

Postby BuxCamper » Oct 26 2011, 4:13am

EKinMN wrote:Amen Brother Groecki....SS Premium Synthetic Low Friction UltraLube! Man that would be worth $15 a quart (even though it would be Amsoil, bought at a volume discount from Mike, at about 1/2 that price!) :lol: :lol:


No, we become our own dealer and buy in bulk from Amsoil, cross out Amsoil with a Sharpie and write KickAss. Sorry Mike for cutting you out of the loop, but its just business. ;)
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Re: Discussion of Dexos oil Certification

Postby Copperhead » Jun 02 2013, 5:16pm

There was a discussion on another GM vehicle site where the valve train was damaged by a disintegrating oil filter. GM refused to honor warrenty due the problems created by that filter as it used poor construction internally. They won that case in court. Now the vehicle owner has to go after the filter manufacturer. (I wonder if the lawyer decided to go against GM first and lose to have better case against the filter maker.)

But that was in keeping with the MM Warranty Act. They showed the filter caused the problem, which is required as part of compliance with the act. So in this case, GM is correct. That really doesn't grow my paranoia gland any. The burden of proof, per the requirements of the warranty act, are on the OEM to prove that what was used caused the problem. It is commonly called "consumer protection".
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Re: Discussion of Dexos oil Certification

Postby Copperhead » Jun 16 2013, 3:38am

For those with a desire to look at the latest from the FTC on these issues......

http://www.consumer.ftc.gov/articles/01 ... aintenance
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Re: Discussion of Dexos oil Certification

Postby Copperhead » Jun 19 2013, 2:26pm

This whole Dexos specification thing really reminds me of a classic shakedown. According to Valvoline, in their FAQ regarding the Dexos thing, they claim that the Dexos spec does demand a slightly higher add pack to handle dispersants and oxidation, but is weaker than the API SN spec regarding ethanol use. Seem intetesting since GM fully on board with E85 usage.

http://www.valvoline.com/promos/dexos.jsp

And the most telling article I came across, was one from the petroleum Jobbers association that went into detail on how the money scam was going to be. GM and their Dexos nonsense is basically an extortion racket. You have to pay an initial fee to get in the game, you have to pay an annual fee to stay in the game, and you have to shell out a cut from each gallon you sell. With the fees rising substantially each year.

The JobbersWorld dexos1 Survey pdf.pdf


Man, if there ever was a money shakedown, the Dexos game is it. And since GM is basically "government motors", there will be no racketeering investigation done regarding this. Man, what a world we live in.
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Re: Discussion of Dexos oil Certification

Postby tsduke » Jun 19 2013, 2:43pm

Copperhead wrote:There was a discussion on another GM vehicle site where the valve train was damaged by a disintegrating oil filter. GM refused to honor warrenty due the problems created by that filter as it used poor construction internally. They won that case in court. Now the vehicle owner has to go after the filter manufacturer. (I wonder if the lawyer decided to go against GM first and lose to have better case against the filter maker.)

But that was in keeping with the MM Warranty Act. They showed the filter caused the problem, which is required as part of compliance with the act. So in this case, GM is correct. That really doesn't grow my paranoia gland any. The burden of proof, per the requirements of the warranty act, are on the OEM to prove that what was used caused the problem. It is commonly called "consumer protection".


Not sure I can agree with the burden of proof being on the OEM. The vehicle owner is the one bearing the cost to fix it while the fight rolls on. Right or wrong this, for me, is enough to just give in and stick with GM recommended products including Dexos licensed oils.
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Re: Discussion of Dexos oil Certification

Postby Copperhead » Jun 19 2013, 8:00pm

That's what they're counting on. Everyone in lock step and them benefitting financially. I have no problem with those who do not want to go outside their comfort level. I have always had a little bit of "tell me I have to do something and I'll rebel". Not everyone's style.
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Re: Discussion of Dexos oil Certification

Postby CKNSLS » Jun 19 2013, 9:23pm

Copperhead wrote:This whole Dexos specification thing really reminds me of a classic shakedown. According to Valvoline, in their FAQ regarding the Dexos thing, they claim that the Dexos spec does demand a slightly higher add pack to handle dispersants and oxidation, but is weaker than the API SN spec regarding ethanol use. Seem intetesting since GM fully on board with E85 usage.

http://www.valvoline.com/promos/dexos.jsp

And the most telling article I came across, was one from the petroleum Jobbers association that went into detail on how the money scam was going to be. GM and their Dexos nonsense is basically an extortion racket. You have to pay an initial fee to get in the game, you have to pay an annual fee to stay in the game, and you have to shell out a cut from each gallon you sell. With the fees rising substantially each year.

The JobbersWorld dexos1 Survey pdf.pdf


Man, if there ever was a money shakedown, the Dexos game is it. And since GM is basically "government motors", there will be no racketeering investigation done regarding this. Man, what a world we live in.


Coperhead-what's the deal? You seem to be on a one man crusade against the Dexos oils. What gives? Just asking!
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Re: Discussion of Dexos oil Certification

Postby Copperhead » Jun 19 2013, 9:34pm

I am always interested in how things play out in the background. If GM had not tried to scare everyone with their "we will void the warranty if you do not use a Dexos approved oil" nonsense, then I would have not given it a second thought. I am in trucking, and the various engine manufacturers have tried this to varying levels in the past regarding their stuff. And what is so wrong with the ILSAC GF-5 and API SN specifications? Nothing. They are on par with Dexos. And there are several brands out there that actually exceed the Dexos specification, yet they do not feel the need to play footsie with GM and pay royalties for the Dexos certification. I detest con games on any level. And this is one.

When one digs into the technicalities, they will find that the Dexos spec is not all that hot. Especially the contradiction GM has going on.... pumping out flex fuel E85 vehicles, yet the Dexos spec is the weakest of all the current specs regarding ethanol usage. That proves that this is a con. And when tested side by side, there are many (not all) of the so-called "certified" oils that barely meet a minimum specification no matter which one we look at. They barely pass muster as being engine oils at all.

If folks are only comfortable with a Dexos "approve" oil, that is just fine. No gripe here. I am only relaying information for folks to come to their own informed conclusion. I have mine. I haven't even mentioned what oil I prefer, and don't plan to. Will it be a Dexos approved one? Only I will know. So, to your point, I am not on a crusade against Dexos, I am just showing that it is not some high and mighty specification that everyone needs to fret over.
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